EPISODE S.4, E.5

Heather (00:08):
Welcome back to another episode of the Brew Deck Podcast, and Happy International Women’s Day and Women’s History Month. As is tradition, at least for the past two years now on the Brew Deck Podcast, we’ll be taking the month of March to talk about Pink Boots Brew and women in the brewing industry. I am joined by two amazing women in the brewing industry, Natasha and Cheyenne.

Natasha (00:33):
Thanks so much for having me. Excited to be back for another year.

Heather (00:36):
Yeah. We definitely pull you in for this one quite often, but-

Natasha (00:40):
I’m okay with that.

Heather (00:40):
As we have had Natasha on the podcast a few times, I’m still going to make her introduce herself to everybody. So Natasha, tell everybody a little bit about yourself and your current role with Canada Malting.

Natasha (00:52):
Yeah. I guess things have changed a little bit since last year, so great time for reintroduction. I am now a production supervisor at our plant here at Canada Malting in Calgary, Alberta. So been here for about three months now, and I’m really loving it. It’s pretty exciting, actually.

Heather (01:12):
Yeah. We’re very happy to have you as part of our team. A few other notes on Natasha, she happens to be the Pink Boots Canadian Chapter President. She is also an advanced cicerone, and has done judging for competitions such as GABF. Recently, Natasha has made the switch to some non-alcoholic choices, so can you tell us something about your favorite non-alcoholic beer options right now, Natasha?

Natasha (01:36):
Yeah. I mean, I’ve been trying them all, so it’s been really fun, but there’s a couple that stood out for me. Deschutes makes an incredible non-alcoholic version of their Black Butte, and I actually tried it side by side with their leaded version or their alcohol version, and I was pretty impressed, is what I would have to say there. They really nailed that one. Who else is putting out some good stuff? Athletic. They do a really good job of, especially making hop-forward beers. That’s something that I find is a little more difficult, to find a non-alcoholic, hop-forward beer. They’re doing a really good job of that, and then Bière Sans Alcohol in Quebec does really good fruited sours.

Heather (02:26):
Oh, nice.

Natasha (02:26):
Yeah. I mean, I’ve been trying them all.

Heather (02:29):
You’ve got the palette for it too, so it’s good to hear. There’s some really, really nice options out there, and we’ll definitely have to check some of those out. You’re going to be brewing tomorrow for International Women’s Day up at Alley Cat in Edmonton. Can you let us in on a little info about the Brew?

Natasha (02:46):
Correct. Yeah, I’m really excited, because when I left my job as production manager at [inaudible 00:02:53] to come over to Canada Malting here, I was like, “But where am I going to brew for Pink Boots Brew?” It’s my 10th year participating, so I got invited to a big collab brew up in Edmonton, and Alley Cat Brewing is going to be the host up there. One of our members, Wynn, who works with Blind Enthusiasm, another great brewery up in northern Alberta there, they put together this amazing collaborative, so we’re bringing a hazy session ale. I think there’s going to be quite a group of us, and they’ve kind of incorporated an educational point as well, so we have somebody talking about malt, yeast, water, hops, and I’ll be adding in there with a little bit on Pink Boots Canada and what we’re doing for our Canadian members.

Heather (03:49):
Oh, I love that. I know we talked about this before we actually started recording, but Natasha was the host brewer for my very first Pink Boots Brew, not my last either.

Natasha (03:58):
And fourth, and fifth.

Heather (03:59):
And second, yes. That was one of the last things we did before the lockdown.

Natasha (04:06):
Yes.

Heather (04:06):
Was that Sunday at Last Best in Calgary, brewing, so definitely fond in my mind. Cheyenne, you used to be the Pink Boots Chapter President of Washington.

Cheyenne (04:16):
Yes, the Seattle Chapter in Washington. Unfortunately, for me, I started right at the very beginning of COVID, back in 2020, SO we had to pivot a little bit and find some fun things to do separate from each other, but yeah, it was a fun time for everyone.

Heather (04:33):
Any favorite past Pink Boots Brews that you’ve done?

Cheyenne (04:37):
Oh, god. I love hosting them. I always think it’s super fun to put all of the work into kind of planning. As we’ll hear a little bit in this episode of the people who are planning their Pink Boots, you get people involved, and that’s the most fun part, where you kind of get to talk about the recipe building and all of that. I love getting to host them. That’s my favorite part, so I did quite a few hosts at my old brewery, Drew Brew and Snoqualmie Pass.

Heather (05:03):
Oh, that’s awesome. A couple of things we’re going to touch on today. My lovely friend, Shanleigh Thomson from Yakima Chief Hops is going to be joining me, so we can kind of fill everybody in on our little bad weather tour that we’ve been doing through Western Canada through this year. Then, of course, we’re going to have another Ask Abi segment, so make sure to stay tuned and listen to those.

Cheyenne (05:24):
I’m very excited for the Ask Abi segment. That one’s going to be a fun one this time.

Heather (05:28):
Mm-hmm.

Cheyenne (05:29):
Awesome. Well, before we get into it, our guests today include Brittany Frey from MadTree Brewing in Cincinnati, Ohio, and Karlie Pretty-McDonald from Tofino Brewing in Vancouver Island. They’re both talking with us today about their Pink Boots Brew, so let’s get into it.

Heather (05:45):
And we are joined now by Brittany Frey, production manager from MadTree Brewing in Cincinnati, Ohio, and she’s also the chapter leader of the Cincinnati Pink Boots. Welcome, Brittany.

Brittany (05:56):
Hi. Great to be on here.

Heather (05:58):
Well, thank you. Thanks for joining us today. Let’s just dive right in, and why don’t you tell us a bit about yourself, how you got into the industry, and all about you?

Brittany (06:09):
Sure. Quick synopsis, I guess. I was born here in Cincinnati, haven’t really left, obviously, and I’ve been with MadTree Brewing now for three years. Just celebrated that this past December, and have been in my current role for two. Previous to that, I was a brewer, production brewer at MadTree, and I am one of the Cincinnati State graduates. They have a brewing science program. From that program, I was a co-op at a smaller brewery here locally, called Swine City. From there, I gained a ton of knowledge, and then migrated over to MadTree to get more production brewing under my belt. When I’m not at work, I am hanging out with my two dogs and my husband, and we like to go camping, hiking, they are getting older, so we tend to find ourselves hanging out a lot more on brewery patios.

Heather (07:11):
I do that with my dog all the time. Both Cheyenne and I have seen your dogs too.

Cheyenne (07:17):
Old dogs are the best. We love old dogs.

Brittany (07:21):
Oh, they’re the best snuggle buddies ever. I love them.

Heather (07:26):
Well, that’s awesome. Can you kind of dive into a little bit about the history of MadTree itself?

Brittany (07:33):
Sure. MadTree started out on a 15-barrel system back in 2013 in Oakley, Ohio. It’s a suburb of Cincinnati, and they were brewing seven days a week, about six to seven turns a day, on the 15-barrel system. We wear the first canned beer in Ohio with our house IPA psychopathy. From there, we just exponentially grow. In 2017, we moved into our current facility that houses a 100-barrel brewhouse, and then our tried and true 15 barrel for test batching. We’ve grown the past 10 years. Actually, we just celebrated 10 years last week.

Heather (08:25):
Oh, that’s awesome.

Brittany (08:26):
Doing their gigantic party, and celebrated with some of our brewery friends in the Cincinnati area and outside with their beers. With the 10 years of our business, we’ve grown to the second location, and we just opened up a restaurant tap room down in the Over-the-Rhine district in Cincinnati last year, and we have more room to grow. We’re already talking about our next tap room that’ll be coming in the Cincinnati area soon.

Heather (09:01):
Oh, wow. So thanks to look forward to.

Brittany (09:04):
Yes, yes. Lots of good things.

Heather (09:07):
So a lot of the things that I’m kind of seeing about MadTree when I was playing on the website there, all about sustainability.

Brittany (09:14):
Yes, that is one of our highly practiced beliefs here at MadTree. We are part of the 1% for the Planet, and what that kind of means is 1% of our profits is donated to nonprofit locations that are focused on our core values. One of our bigger nonprofits in the area is the Cincinnati Zoo. We work with the Cincinnati Parks Foundations.

(09:45)
There’s a couple other nonprofits that is called Adventure Crew, and we focus on helping them reach their goals to help build the Cincinnati area. So that’s either through our profit dollars, but then also everyone in our company, whether you’re part-time or full-time, has volunteer hours, where we go and we help these nonprofits as well. We’ve gone down to help make new trails in the Cincinnati area and our hiking systems. We’ve helped plant, I think last year was over 5,000 trees.

Heather (10:22):
Oh, wow.

Brittany (10:24):
We have a lot of push in the local area to help build the canopy in the lower canopy areas that are in the main city of Cincinnati, is one of our biggest constant pushes for helping these nonprofits.

Heather (10:40):
That’s wonderful. Very community driven.

Brittany (10:43):
Yes.

Cheyenne (10:43):
Yeah, that’s awesome. I mean, it sounds like, between all of the 1% for the Planet volunteering that you’re doing, plus volunteering in your local Pink Boots Chapter, you’re very kind of community-oriented, it sounds like.

Brittany (10:57):
Yes. I would say it’s really helped me build as a person, being involved with all of the stuff that MadTree has offered us, but then pushing myself to help others see the benefit of pushing your community up.

Cheyenne (11:13):
That’s wonderful. That’s very cool. Well, kind of focusing more on the Pink Boots aspect of everything, can you tell us a little bit about what you’re doing to celebrate International Women’s Day this year?

Brittany (11:25):
Yeah. So every year, we build a beverage where we collaborate with all of the identifying females within MadTree. We choose the beverage, and we work on the recipe together. We really hone in on educating our employees on the process of making our products, has always been one of the core things that we’ve worked on with this program internally.

(11:58)
In the past, we’ve always chosen what we call a Trailblazer woman, and that person is featured on our product, as well as we dive into the history of them and pull some really cool things about them into the recipe of the product. I keep saying product, because this year it’s not a beer, which is the first time ever. For instance, in the past last year, we chose Katherine Johnson, who worked with NASA, one of the NASA computers. I decided to use some Apollo hops in there as well as some comment. We had a special [inaudible 00:12:45] yeast from Berkeley that we used. It was very space themed with all of our ingredients, and then she was featured on a can.

Cheyenne (12:54):
Wow. That’s wonderful. What a cool idea.

Brittany (12:56):
Yeah. It’s a lot of fun, kind of pushing my boundaries as a brewer and recipe writer, but then also being able to include so many other great ideas from all the women, has really helped push this program farther than what I ever thought it would’ve been when we kind of incorporated it five years ago.

Cheyenne (13:18):
Yeah. For sure, and so this year you’re doing a ready to drink beverage for International Women’s Day. Is that correct?

Brittany (13:24):
Yes. So we launched a new product line last year called Sway. It’s a ready-to-drink cocktail. It’s a Vodka base, and it’s around four-and-a-half percent with always two flavors involved with it. This year for International Women’s Day, we decided to change it up and really push ourselves to teach our employees what help this product has developed, and so people can see the behind the scenes, what goes into building a ready-to-drink cocktail. So this year, as a group, we decided to honor the great Dolly Parton, and so she is on a can.

Heather (14:10):
Amazing.

Brittany (14:12):
Oh my God. It’s such a beautiful can. I told our artist, I was like, “You literally brought me to tears when I saw this. It’s so beautiful.” But yeah, we’re doing a ready-to-drink cocktail. It’ll be peach and blueberry flavored. Instead of the usual 4.5% that we’ve had with these products in the past, we’re pushing ourselves to create a 7.6%.

Heather (14:36):
Ooh.

Brittany (14:39):
Yeah. It’s so good. We’ve done a lot of research on how we can create higher ABV ready-to-drink cocktails, and not have that burning sensation that you get with higher ABV products. We’ve learned, as the Women of MadTree, how to create this product. We went through three different sensory trials to dial in the best recipe that we could, and we’re also expanding our knowledge in this ready-to-drink cocktail line so we can keep creating and expanding this line in the future.

Cheyenne (15:19):
That sounds so cool. I love that idea. Dolly Parton, peach blueberry. I’m in. That sounds awesome.

Heather (15:26):
That sounds fantastic.

Brittany (15:30):
We’re very excited.

Cheyenne (15:31):
Yeah, no. I am too. I don’t even live in Ohio. I might have to make a trip out there to get some.

Heather (15:37):
We’re calling CJ immediately.

Brittany (15:39):
Yes, yes. Tell CJ to come and get you guys some.

Cheyenne (15:42):
That’s awesome. I mean, you already kind of touched on it a little bit, how you’re working with the women of MadTree to kind of collaborate on this recipe together, but can you tell us a little bit about how you’re incorporating educational components into the blending day with all of the women from your company?

Brittany (15:59):
Sure. This year, with going to a ready-to-drink beverage, it was very different, because in the past they would just join me on the brew deck, and we would have a great time together, learning. This year, obviously, is a little different because it’s just all on the cold side. We’re blending the product in our bright tank, carbonated it, and then packaging it the next day.

(16:25)
The education more came while we were dialing in the recipe to understand what ratios of the peach and the blueberry worked best. And so the women of MadTree, they got to understand more of what’s the behind the scene, what our lab does for this type of product. We have a statistician that we work with locally that helps us pull in all of our sensory components that we do for all of these. I think, for Dolly, we must have had over 55 different renditions of a peach and a blueberry blend.

Cheyenne (17:10):
Wow.

Brittany (17:10):
He brought all that in together for us, and we got to go from there, and basically picked the optimums from all of those different choices. All of the women got to help that part of the process, so they’re understanding, from the very beginning when we just get a few little samples, to how we really dial in that perfect recipe for that product, and then how we package it.

Cheyenne (17:36):
That’s very cool. So it sounds like a lot of sensory was involved with the group?

Brittany (17:40):
Yes, and a lot of our women have been very keen onto beer sensory, so this was a whole different type of sensory learning experiment for them.

Cheyenne (17:52):
That’s very cool. I love that. Sensory is so important in our industry, so it’s very cool that you get a chance to do that as a group together. Awesome. Well, like we mentioned at the top of the recording here, you are the Pink Boots Chapter Leader for your Cincinnati Chapter. Can you tell us a little bit about what’s going on in your Pink Boots Chapter right now? Is there anything that you’re currently working on?

Brittany (18:15):
So we’re not working on anything currently right now as a Chapter. There has been a lot of more individual breweries in the area that are collaborating with the Pink Boots. If we’re able to go on those brew days, we go. Unfortunately, a lot of us always are working during a typical brew day session, so it’s less frequented, unfortunately, by us, but we go to the releases. Actually, it’s been really cool this year to see how the breweries are expanding. They are collaborating with pink boots, but they’re also choosing some other nonprofits locally that this is benefiting. For example, like Urban Artifact, the [inaudible 00:19:01] Cincinnati, and Yellow Springs Brewery up in Dayton, they collaborated, and a part of their profits are going to the Cincinnati Brewing Science program to help an identifying female with a scholarship.

Cheyenne (19:15):
Wow. That’s awesome.

Brittany (19:17):
Yeah, so everyone is kind of understanding how we can help each other and continue to diversify the brewing industry, and they’re using inspiration from these brew days to help see where the gaps are and how they can help close those gaps.

Cheyenne (19:36):
Very cool.

Heather (19:37):
Well, something else really awesome that was kind of brought to our attention that you do is this Ascending Women Program?

Brittany (19:44):
Oh, yes. It’s such a really cool program, and it actually kind of all started with our International Women’s Day a couple of years ago we brewed our beer inspired by Malala, and this was right before we had to shut down for COVID. We had a local woman come in, and we just had a chat. It was about, I can’t remember the subject now. It was a couple of years ago, and COVID always feels like it added five years to everyone’s lives.

Heather (20:23):
It definitely did.

Brittany (20:23):
But it was a way that we invited all of the identifying females of MadTree. We came together. We had a little luncheon. We celebrated our beer that we had packaged the day before, and from there, it inspired our private events team and our consumer experience team to put together something once a month, where we’re pulling in people that can talk about different subject matters that yes, it does appeal mostly to women, but it can expand outside of that. So for example, for February, we just had one, it actually was last night, where the panel discussed self-love. It’s either local women that are brought in that are a part of the panel or at least close by, and it’s just a couple of hours of sitting and listening to this panel. We have women-owned businesses that are also represented there, and it’s just kind of a way to build that community locally.

Heather (21:31):
What an awesome program. That is absolutely fantastic. Before we wrap this, a, I want to know when is Dolly being released?

Brittany (21:45):
On International Women’s Day, March 8th? It’ll be in the tap room, and really cool this year. We’re actually expanding this product to be out in our distribution network. It’s never left our tap room before, and it’s just grown every year from the beginning. This year is our biggest year yet volume wise and farthest-reaching wise, so you can find it on shelves too, which is amazing.

Heather (22:14):
Will that be all over Ohio or just in the Cincinnati area?

Brittany (22:19):
Just in the Cincinnati area and northern Kentucky.

Heather (22:23):
Awesome. So everybody, is it just called Dolly? I’m just calling it Dolly now.

Brittany (22:28):
Oh, yeah. It’s Dolly. It’s so beautiful on the front of the can. It’s such brightly colored, and then it just has Sway on the bottom. So yeah, we’re calling it Dolly.

Heather (22:39):
Awesome.

Brittany (22:40):
Yeah.

Heather (22:41):
Before we wrap, if you could go back in time, you’ve been working in the industry for quite a while now, and give yourself any advice before you actually got into the industry or right in your beginning stages, what would you say to yourself? Any inspirational advice for Little Brittany before she started making all the beer?

Brittany (23:03):
I wish I would’ve believed in myself more. I would definitely go back and push that really hard into myself. Believe that you can do it. If that person can do it, then, sure as hell, you can. Yeah, a lot of second guessing myself in the beginning, and I wish I wouldn’t have done it.

Heather (23:24):
100%. I think that’s second ongoing theme. Awesome, and what inspires you about the craft beer industry?

Brittany (23:33):
I think just the community that it builds and that I never have to stop learning. There’s just so much that is being done in beer and the craft beverage industry. I really, honestly, haven’t stopped learning since day one. It’s pretty cool that I’m not just stuck.

Heather (23:53):
Yeah, for sure. Something new every day. Well, awesome, Brittany. Thank you so much for joining us today, talking kind of Pink Boots and all that fun stuff. Everybody check out MadTree Brewing, and if you’re in the Cincinnati area, take a look for Dolly on the shelves. We are now joined by Karlie Pretty-McDonald, assistant brewer and kind of lovely lady in charge of QA and all things yeast at Tofino Brewing out on Vancouver Island. Welcome, Karlie.

Karlie (24:25):
Thanks. Thanks for having me.

Heather (24:27):
Let’s just start, dive right in, and tell us all about you and how you got into craft beer.

Karlie (24:34):
Okay, cool. Basically, I graduated high school in 2013 and moved out of Surrey to little Kamloops for Bachelor of Science at TRU. Along the way, I kind of got into the craft beer scene. My sister kind of, who’s older than I am, was like, “If you want to come home and hang out with me during the summer, you have to drink beer,” so I was kind of forced into craft beer at first, but learned to love it pretty quickly. Then, got into some more microbiology stuff throughout my degree, and got really interested in the powers of yeast and all the things it can do. At one point, I needed to take some elective credits, and TRU was offering, for the first time ever, a brewing info kind of course. I decided to take it, and kind of had an “Oh” moment, where I was like, “I don’t want to be a vet anymore. I love this. How do I get into this?”

(25:47)
Conveniently, that same older sister was going to KPU, where they offer the brewing program, and she was like, “Oh, hey. They just started this whole brewing thing. Maybe you should apply, give it a go.”

(26:00)
And so I said, “Screw it,” and tossed in an application.

(26:06)
One of the pros of being a female in the brewing industry is you kind of become the token female, so I got in, no problem. Yeah, so started at KPU. I think it was maybe 2016, 2017, and the rest is kind of history from there. Went through the program, graduated 2019, met some really great people. Started my first brewing job at Yellow Dog Brewing in Port Moody, where I kind of started on the packaging line and worked my way up to cellar men or cellar woman. The person, the cellar dweller. I don’t know. Then, from there, I got a opportunity to actually do some brewing at R&B, and that was through a friend of mine, [Kazz 00:27:00], who was the head brewer, and we had met through KPU. Yeah, got a lot of experience there. He really helped me gain some confidence in my abilities, in terms of brewing and recipe development.

(27:15)
Then, from there, where did I go from there? Oh, I went to Fraser Mills, which is also in Port Moody. My friend, Christie, who is also a alumni of the brewing program, hired me on as her assistant. When I first started, the brewery was still just kind of empty tanks, being put together, and lots of construction happening, so her and I basically were just designing recipes, planning brews, making SOPs, all that kind of fun stuff, and then just learning how to brew on this. It was a relatively high-tech brew system for how small it was. It was only 14 hec or something pretty itty bitty. But yeah, that was a great experience, just learning how to start from nothing, and then was there for two years, and just got really tired of the rat race. It was just go, go, go. It never really seemed to stop.

(28:23)
I didn’t really have a life outside of beer for a really, really long time, and was feeling kind of the passion and the love for brewing was kind of dead, and I needed something to kind of revamp that and revive that. Just happened to see that Tofino Brewing was hiring, and I was like, “There’s no way I would get hired at Tofino Brewing. I’m still relatively new to the whole thing, and they’re been around since 2011. They probably want somebody more experienced.” Anyways, happened to toss in a resume, and got an email two days later from Andy, the head brewer, and he’s like, “Hey, I’d love to set up a interview.” We ended up just chatting on the phone for two hours about kinds of beer we like, things we don’t really love about the industry, and all that kind of stuff. Now here I am. Been here for, it’ll be a year in April, so still pretty new to Tofino, but I’ve been having a really great time with it.

Heather (29:30):
That’s awesome. I love Tofino. We were making Cheyenne kind of Google where Tofino is and look at pictures of Tofino today, and I think she is probably pretty jealous of your general location right now.

Cheyenne (29:42):
I’m very jealous. I don’t know how to surf, but looking at the photos of Tofino makes me want to learn how to surf.

Karlie (29:49):
I also don’t know how to surf. People from Tofino that may be listening to this, please do not come for me.

Heather (29:57):
Have you tried since you moved out there? Is that something-

Karlie (30:00):
Yeah, I have tried. During the whole interview kind of process, Andy seemed pretty keen to get me out here. I had never been to Tofino before, actually working here, and so the brewery brought me and my partner, at the time, out for a little weekend to see if we even like the town, like the vibe. One of the guys that works the brewery, his name’s Allan, he was our sales rep at the time, but now he’s kind of gotten into the production side with us. He also was a surf instructor for five years, so he took us out surfing, and it was great. It’s tons of fun, but I just didn’t quite catch the surfing bug.

Heather (30:41):
I heard it’s really hard. I haven’t tried either. Honestly, I’ve heard it’s really, really hard.

Karlie (30:48):
It’s very hard, but the kind of nice thing about Tofino is, if you fall, you’re just falling into sand, while if you were to probably, I don’t know, surf off California, I actually don’t know what California beaches look like, but maybe they’re really rocky. I feel like that would be very painful.

Heather (31:05):
Somebody write in and tell us what California beaches are like.

Karlie (31:07):
We’re not surf experts here.

Heather (31:10):
Obviously not.

Karlie (31:11):
You know what? Let’s just change this to a surfing podcast, and we can just make assumptions of what happens.

Cheyenne (31:15):
Yeah. Let us know.

Heather (31:17):
We’re going to need some surfing experts. Anybody.

Cheyenne (31:19):
Posted by four non-surfers.

Heather (31:24):
We’re going to do amazing.

Karlie (31:26):
It’ll be very popular.

Heather (31:27):
That’s fantastic. Tell us a little bit more about Tofino Brewing. Obviously, I have been there. I’m going to assume Natasha’s been there, being a West Coast girl herself.

Karlie (31:40):
Yeah, so they’ve been around since 2011, started by two guys, Chris and Brian, just a couple of friends. They had a lot of trouble getting this place open. Tofino is pretty cliquey in the terms of what’s going to be allowed in the town. So it was a lot of battling, but once they got it open, it was a very needed breath of life in town. They have been able to actually expand a little bit. They were in a smaller building, like a parking lot, across. They, I think, expanded maybe two or three years ago, and that was the place that you saw now, Heather. I don’t know. I’m still pretty new to it. I don’t have the full story of Tofino Brewing. I just know that they have been an incredible company to work for.

(32:45)
It’s been a really supportive place. Two months into my employment, I actually got second degree burns down my leg, and I was like, “Oh, crap. Here we go. I’m going to have such a headache, just getting worker’s comp.” I just thought I was going to be judged or whatever, the stress of being a new employee. You don’t want to ruffle any feathers or anything like that, but I was treated with nothing but respect and kindness, which was really nice. It was definitely something different from other places that I’ve worked at. They’ve just been really on my side from the get-go, and I have honestly never felt more respected in a place than I have here. If anybody wants to work at Tofino Brewing, I would absolutely endorse that. Chris, the owner, is a really solid guy. The guys in the production, I don’t know, there’s just no ego involved.

(33:50)
Andy, he’s got many, many more years of brewing experience than I do. He’s been a home brewer for years, and then has been at Tofino Brewing for a long time. When I rolled in, I have a lot of ideas. There’s different things that I’ve done in terms of how to crop yeast or things of that nature. They didn’t crop yeast and reuse it before, and that’s something that I’m very much for. It just saves the brewery a lot of money. I mean, if you have it, why not use it again instead of just dumping it down the drain? It seems pretty wasteful. I just had all these ideas, and Andy was like, “Yeah, let’s do it. If you know something that I don’t, I’d love to learn.” I feel the same with him. He’s got knowledge that he’s happy to share with me, and it just never felt like I was stepping on anybody’s toes. All ideas were welcomed, which was really, really cool.

Cheyenne (34:51):
That’s awesome. That’s really great to hear. Well, this episode, we are chatting about the Pink Boots Collaboration Brews that folks are doing this year, so can you tell us a little bit about what you planned to brew this year for the Pink Boots Collaboration Brew?

Karlie (35:05):
For sure. For this year, we wanted to do an Apricot White IPA, and we had planned it, or started planning it, late last year just because we knew that there was going to be a little bit of work put into it, in terms of recipe design. Well, coming up with an idea of recipe design, label design, all that kind of fun stuff, and I really wanted to get the ladies in the tasting room involved. I’m the only woman or female-identifying on the production team, and so I was like, “Well, I don’t want to do this by myself. I would love to include anybody who wants to come in.” And so I gathered the ladies, and we sat down, and kind of started brainstorming one evening over a beer.

(35:57)
They, basically, came up with the idea themselves for an IPA, and they were kind of hoping for an IPA, because they didn’t want to, in their words, make a girly beer. They wanted it to be high alcohol, really punchy, but they also didn’t want to do a West Coast IPA, because they know what their customer’s like, and they’re kind of moving away from that super, overpowering, piney kind of taste. And so they’re like, “Is there anything that we can do that’s still high alcohol, really juicy? Maybe we can add them some fruit into it.” And I had pitched the white IPA, which they were pretty gun ho about, so that was kind of how it started. Then, I basically just came up with the recipe and showed the ladies. They liked it. They wanted to do apricot.

(36:59)
We, originally, were trying to plan for something more of a local fruit, but unfortunately there’s not a lot growing, fruit wise, on the island, unless we were going to do something like salala berries or maybe even a salmonberry, but that’s pretty hard to source. And so they went apricot, because they were like, “Well, it’s still grown in the interior, so it’s still kind of BC, kind of local,” very stretching it a bit. That’s what they came up with, and we just ran with it, and we actually just got our labels for it this week, which is very exciting. They had drawn up a couple of things, so we’re very excited. It’s going to be called Pitted, because surf community. Why not? They’re all a bunch of surfers.

Cheyenne (37:58):
Yeah. You’ve got the pun down. That’s awesome.

Karlie (38:02):
Yeah, so we’re very excited. I’m hoping that a lot of them will show up on Wednesday. I think it’ll be fun. I’d really love to just teach them and show them what I do on a brew day. I’d love to give them some brewers’ tea, so some [inaudible 00:38:18] and a shot of Jameson, get them warmed up and excited.

Cheyenne (38:21):
That’s a rite of passage for any Pink Boots Collaboration Brew, I think.

Karlie (38:26):
Oh, absolutely.

Heather (38:26):
100%.

Karlie (38:30):
So I’m just hoping they’re excited about it. I just thought the Pink Boots blend was saying it’s going to be citrusy and kind of tropically, so I was like, “Oh. Well, apricot, white IPA. Those hops will be perfect.”

Cheyenne (38:45):
Yeah, that sounds awesome.

Karlie (38:46):
And we’re also tossing in a bit of Nelson Sauvignon, just for a little bit of a white wine character, so I think it’ll be nice.

Cheyenne (38:53):
Oh, very cool. Well, it’s awesome to hear that. It sounds like the recipe development was kind of a collaborative effort with you and your entire team, so that’s really cool to hear. I love to hear that stuff.

Karlie (39:06):
Well, I just didn’t want it to be like, “This is my brew.” I wanted it to definitely be like, “No. This is all of ours. You guys are the ones.” They’re the faces, essentially, in the tasting room. They’re the ones that sell it. I’m not. I don’t do that. That’s not my strong suit. That’s their strong suit, so I wanted them to be really passionate about it and be excited to sell something, because how else are you going to sell something so passionately if you’re not involved? I don’t know. It just felt right to keep them included, and they came up with a great idea. I think next Wednesday, when we actually brew this thing, it’ll be awesome and fun. I hope I have a good turnout in terms of bodies, because I don’t want to grain out by myself.

Natasha (40:00):
Yeah. Nobody wants to do that.

Karlie (40:02):
No way.

Natasha (40:05):
That’s awesome that you’re involving so many people. I love hosting folks on the brew day and having them learn something about what we do in production, right? So it’s really cool to hear that you have a bunch of folks who are going to come and help you and have helped with the development of beer.

Karlie (40:28):
Yeah.

Heather (40:29):
I think it’s really interesting, too, having the tap room staff give their feedback on what people are asking for, like be able to provide their feedback on what their customers are actually looking for when it comes to beer, because they would know the best.

Karlie (40:43):
Yeah, and I didn’t want to make something that was just going to stay in our warehouse. Of course, I want us all to have fun and it to be something that they like, but at the same time, it’s still a business. They would know better than I do what is selling or what people are asking for at least, and so I definitely thought they were quite the asset to get involved.

Cheyenne (41:14):
Definitely a team effort, so that’s super cool to hear. You kind of touched a little bit already on how the citrus notes of the Pink Boots blend this year., You’re using that in your Apricot, white IPA. Can you dig a little bit more and tell us about how that hot blend is going to kind of play into your recipe development and what you hope to see in your final product?

Karlie (41:36):
Yeah, so I’m just really hoping that it will really accentuate the kind of juicy, tropical flavors of an apricot or stone fruit flavors of an apricot. I just would really like this to be a nice, juicy, approachable IPA, and I really think that those citrus stone fruit, tropical notes will really help push that forward. I think the little bit of herbaceousness will round that flavor a bit.

(42:15)
What we were planning for this to be is a very approachable IPA. I don’t want people to be scared of IPAs. They’re not all these crazy, bitter bombs. They are quite complex and quite delicious when you give them a chance. I find that a lot of breweries, when they have their tasting notes underneath an IPA, it’ll be bitter or hoppy. And it’s just like, “Well, what does that mean?” Hoppyness could be a lot of things. Every hop has a different characteristic, so what does hoppy mean? And so I just want this to be something that, even somebody who says they don’t like IPAs, is going to like because of those nice, citrusy stone fruit notes of the hop.

Cheyenne (43:06):
Accessible to all beer drinkers. I love that.

Karlie (43:09):
Exactly.

Heather (43:11):
I love the aspect of the education too, right? Because it’s like, what does hoppy mean? Did you do any educational components with the team when you’re getting ready to do recipe development? Do you think that that’ll kind of play out into educating the folks who are coming into your tap room about it?

Karlie (43:29):
Yeah, absolutely. Like I was saying to you guys, explaining to them, when we’re describing a beer, we shouldn’t be, not that you shouldn’t, but I like to stay away from things like hoppy, because it’s too broad. There’s so many aspects to hops, and to just narrow it down to a word as hoppy, as a consumer, I’d be like, “Well, what does that mean?” And so I sat them down and was explaining how, first of all, there’s so many strains of hops, how every hop has a different characteristic. They’re used for different things, whether it be bittering, aroma, or a blend of the two. So we definitely had to sit down and dig through that a bit, because there was a little bit of confusion of what hops do, when they’re added, or how they’re added.

(44:31)
So we definitely talked about that in quite a lot of detail, which was really cool, and so I’m hoping that they’ve kind of expressed that to the customers since that meeting, and I hope that that conversation will continue. During my time at KPU, we did a lot of sensory training, and that’s definitely something that I would like to continue to bring to any place that I work. One of the things that we would like to tackle this year, we tried to tackle it last year, but it got a little crazy, is sensory training and teaching our staff, specifically the tasting room staff, how to identify off flavors in beer, just so that if a customer ever comes up and they’re like, “Oh. This beer tastes gross,” they can maybe dig a little deeper with that customer, and be like, “Oh. Well, what does it taste like?” and then go taste it for themselves.

(45:25)
Maybe it’s diacetyl, or maybe it’s like acetyl aldehyde or whatever. Hopefully not something crazy like isovaleric, because that would be awful. But yeah, just getting them to be able to identify the nuances of beer, because it is complex. I don’t think a lot of people realize that, and so I think during that little sit-down session, when we were talking about a recipe, I think they realized how much actually goes into planning a beer, things that you should expect during the fermentation process, and all that kind of fun stuff or things that I think is fun stuff.

Heather (46:07):
Yeah. It’s amazing. I mean, I think sometimes beer gets bad rap of being a simple beverage, but there’s so much nuance that goes into designing a recipe. I mean, you’re talking about one component there with the hops, and there’s so much more that goes into it, right? So it’s pretty rad that we can take all of that education that you have, you can translate it to the staff, and then it’s just a benefit to the beer community where you’re at too.

Karlie (46:34):
Totally. It’s just, I don’t know, you can definitely make it just fun for them. It’s just a new way to even serve a beer. If you have a bunch of regulars on a slow night, you can even just sit them down and show them or try to describe to them the differences in taste between a pilsner and a lager, or a pilsner and a blonde. Yeah, they seem like such similar beers, but if you really try, you can break down the subtle differences of them all.

Natasha (47:07):
I agree, and that’s why I always say there’s a beer for everybody. Everybody.

Heather (47:13):
Agree with that.

Karlie (47:13):
Mm-hmm. You will find one.

Heather (47:15):
That’s great, so you’re going to be brewing on March 8th. When can we look for this release? Is it going to be tap room only? Are we going to see it in cans?

Karlie (47:26):
You will be seeing it in cans. The release date will probably be anywhere between, I would say, two-and-a-half weeks to four weeks after brewing it. It’ll be in cans. It’s quite the epic label; however, it’ll be brewed under our “pilot batch system.” It’s 35 hecs, so still quite large, but for those beers, we typically just sell them in cans out of our tasting room. You’ll just have to come to Tofino and try it.

Heather (47:58):
Oh, shucks. I want to touch on a couple more things, Karlie, because we did this last year, and I really, really liked it when we did our Pink Boots Brew podcast last year. We asked all the brewers that we had come on and talk, what kind of inspires them and what kind of inspired them to get into the industry. Also, if you could go back in time and give little Karlie some advice before she got into the craft beer industry, what would you tell yourself?

Karlie (48:30):
Okay, so just a couple questions. I guess, if I had to go back to little Karlie to get ready for the brewing industry, I’d say get ready to get dirty.

Heather (48:47):
Excellent advice.

Karlie (48:48):
First of all, get some good boots. Also, always make sure you’re wearing proper PPE. There’s been one too many times that I’ve gotten hurt during brewing. I guess it would just be like, don’t be discouraged. There are a couple bad eggs that will make you question why you’re in this, but do not doubt your skill, and do not doubt your knowledge. Maybe it’s just not the right fit for you, but you will find your little brewing family, and so far, I’ve kept that little brewing family that I’ve made along the way. They have been nothing but supportive and nothing but my little cheerleaders in the background, even if I don’t get to see them every day. In terms of what inspires me, just in my general life, Stevie Nicks. God bless her. I love her. She’s a total bad-

Heather (49:47):
Fantastic answer.

Karlie (49:48):
Yeah. Just like don’t listen to the bullshit. You’re awesome, and if you want to roast your ex on stage, fricking roast your ex on stage.

Heather (50:03):
Why not?

Karlie (50:06):
But in terms of beer, I had some really great instructors at KPU. Nancy More. I don’t know if you guys know Nancy. She’s kind of an icon in the brewing, or at least in the circle that I’ve been in. She’s quite the icon. I would definitely recommend looking her up, because she’s done a lot for the beer industry all over the world, has opened up many, many breweries throughout the world, and she’s just so freaking cool. If I could be a fraction of how cool Nancy More is, I think I would die very happily. So I would definitely look into her.

(50:45)
She’s just just so cool, down to earth, just knows her stuff, and is so easily approachable. She wants to talk beer and have a pint with ya. She’s great. Then, Martina, she was the microbiologist at KPU. She’s fantastic, and I have learned so much from her in terms of just laboratory procedures, and she’s really cool too. So I would say, in the brewing industry, they’re my inspiration. I would love to just shout them out constantly. They’re great. That’s kind of where, I guess, I draw my inspiration from, is these wonderful women that I have met throughout my journey here, and then Stevie Nicks, who is just awesome all the time.

Heather (51:41):
That’s super bad. So I’m sorry. Nancy, she was one of the first female brew masters in Canada, was she not?

Karlie (51:47):
Hell yeah, she was.

Heather (51:49):
Yeah, and Natasha, did she not moderate the panel you were on?

Natasha (51:53):
She did, yeah. She moderated our panel at the BC Craft Brewers conference. It was pretty awesome. She’s also going to be an upcoming guest speaker at our educational series for Pink Boots Canada this year, so we’re really excited to have her on for our members.

Karlie (52:10):
Everybody who’s listening to this podcast, go to that, because Nancy is amazing.

Heather (52:15):
Big shout out to Nancy.

Karlie (52:18):
Always.

Heather (52:19):
Is there anything else kind of going on at the brewery that you want to plug? I know you’re probably a lot busier come summer months and stuff, but anything kind of up and coming that we should look for with Tofino Brewing?

Karlie (52:32):
Well, of course the International Women’s Day Brew, for sure. Come check that out. Honestly, just keep an eye on our social media. We have some pretty fun things planned. We’re going to be trying some very old, old, old school brewing techniques here, I think next month, actually. I won’t dive into it too much, just in case things change, but just think good, old Finnish beer styles. We’re doing some crazy things. We’re just trying to keep ourselves interesting and innovative. I would just say, just keep an eye on the social media, because some crazy stuff’s coming down the pipe this year that I’m very excited for.

Cheyenne (53:17):
Awesome.

Heather (53:17):
Very intrigued. I love that.

Cheyenne (53:19):
Me too.

Heather (53:23):
Well, awesome. Thank you so much for joining us today, Karlie. It was great to get to talk to you again and talk beer with you. I mean, if you insist, I will definitely make my way back out to Tofino to come and visit you soon.

Karlie (53:34):
Thanks again for having me.

Heather (53:36):
All right. Now I am joined by my partner in crime right now and not a stranger to our podcast, Shanleigh Thompson from Yakima Chief Hops. Welcome, Shanleigh.

Shanleigh (53:48):
Hi. Glad to be here. Thanks for having me.

Heather (53:52):
So I mentioned my partner in crime right now. Obviously, Shanleigh and I have the same sales territory. We both take care of Western Canada, but we’ve kind of been working on a little fun trip through the winter months called The Bad Weather Tour, and we just kind of wanted to chat a little bit about it, let everybody kind of know what we’re doing, where to find us, where to follow along with everything. But Shanleigh, this was your brainchild, so I will let you kind of give the lowdown to everybody listening.

Shanleigh (54:23):
Amazing.

Heather (54:24):
The viewers.

Shanleigh (54:25):
Yeah. Well, it all started really with discussing what our travel plans were for co-travel, coming up for the winter months. Again, like Heather said, we have the same territory, so that includes basically Winnipeg and Saskatchewan west and north, so that’s Saskatchewan, Alberta, BC, Nunavut, Yukon, and Northwest Territory. So we were discussing how we were going to navigate seeing everyone or a good proportion of people in the winter months, because a lot of them are inaccessible or less accessible during the months of, really, October to May.

(55:08)
So when we were discussing what we were going to do for travel and where we were going to go, I think we were discussing setting up these crop updates like we had done for the BC Beer Con, and discussing in depth a little bit more about the agricultural components of our territory and our companies, in general. So when we went to go discuss that, I thought to myself, “It would be really funny if we did kind of a tour, like we’re rock stars, but obviously we’re discussing ingredients for brewing,” which is not super sexy, but I-

Heather (55:46):
I was going to say, we’re not-not rock stars.

Shanleigh (55:49):
I mean, we are rock stars.

Heather (55:50):
Right?

Shanleigh (55:52):
You’re absolutely correct, but I thought that would be really fun to do something, kind of like a tour, have merch, and just be really silly about it. So I think that’s really where the idea came from, and then, really, the name came from the fact that it is really miserable in most of the places we went and are going at this time of year, so Bad Weather was born.

Heather (56:17):
The Bad Weather Tour has really been living up to its name as well. We were in torrential downpours when we were on the island and crazy winds, and then Saskatchewan really showed up with the -40 degrees with the wind chill last week when we were there. We do have a website. We have an Instagram everybody can go ahead and follow. It’s just @BadWeatherTour. It’ll kind of give you a synopsis of where we’re going and what we’re talking about. Of course, Shanleigh and I both have really strong backgrounds in the brewing industry. Shanleigh has a background in food science as well, so we really want to ensure that we’re providing information to brewers, brewery owners, and kind of everybody in the industry about what’s going on with barley crops, hop crops, and everything right now.

Shanleigh (57:12):
I think, yeah. Exactly. We’re really aiming to make this a more technically-focused tour to discuss updates in the market, not only for crops, but also what are the new techniques coming out. For example, mash hopping. What new products are being born of necessity, like the Euro-Pills, for example. These ideas are not necessarily for us to be out here, hard selling, but really just to discuss what can be done. It’s a difficult landscape right now for brewers, and especially in the supply side with, really, everything happening over the last few years. What we’re trying to provide is some additional information so people can make educated decisions based on new research coming out, the current crops, and really what’s best for their brewery. Again, what you said, Heather. You’ve been in the industry for what? 10 years plus now

Heather (58:16):
Coming up.

Shanleigh (58:17):
Yeah, and I’ve been working in ingredient sales, supply side, and behind the scenes at breweries, in front of people, all that good stuff, for over 10 years as well. So I think what we also wanted to showcase is we’re here as a resource. We’re here as a reference. We’re here to help. We’re here for you as brewers to be able to help you with what you need to know in order to make those educated decisions.

Heather (58:46):
If you are interested in checking out our website, it is badweathertour.com. Again, you can follow us along on Instagram as well. There’s always some entertaining content on there. We do have merch. Can you tell them a little bit about where all the proceeds from our merch are going, Shanleigh?

Shanleigh (59:04):
Absolutely, so our merch is available through our websites. First of all, it’s order on demand, which allows it to be a little more sustainable, so essentially, we’re not making these items in mass. Every time you order, it gets produced for you specifically. That way, we’re not buttering up a landfill when 2023 Bad Weather ends. That’s just the first thing I wanted to say, because I think it’s important to be conscious of our sustainability when it comes to these endeavors. But also, it goes to the Michael Jackson Foundation for Brewing and Distilling, which is such an important scholarship and educational foundation. So all of our proceeds, all of our profits go to that scholarship fund.

Heather (59:55):
Awesome. Well, thanks for hopping on today, Shanleigh.

Shanleigh (59:59):
You’re welcome.

Heather (01:00:01):
And we are back with our new favorite segment, Ask Abi, where we get to ask Abi, who is our product marketing manager, any question we want. Anything, Abi? We can ask you anything?

Abi (01:00:12):
Anything. Anything you want. It’s a dangerous game.

Heather (01:00:16):
It’s true. It’s true.

Cheyenne (01:00:19):
Well, awesome. So the first question that we got, after our head retention episode, we got this question. How do proteins and pH levels affect head retention?

Abi (01:00:29):
It’s a great question. It’s a very broad one, so I could go on and on and on. I know that we covered some of this in our last episode, like you said, Don’t Lose Your Head, where we discussed science of head retention with John Downing and Jeremy Ross. I could get really in depth, like I said, but for the sake of time, I’m just going to keep it short and sweet. There are a few factors when it comes to proteins and head retention, so I’m just going to stick to focusing on pH and its importance for proteins in the brewing process.

(01:01:00)
Optimal pH is important in the mash, as it influences enzyme efficiency in converting sugars, as well as breaking down proteins. Some enzymes that are responsible for protein breakdown are more efficient at lower pH levels, which is around 5.2 to 5.4. Lowering mash pH can actually affect pro protein solubility as well as your distribution of light chain and medium chain proteins. A higher level of medium shaped proteins typically results in more head retention. During the boil, a lower pH can reduce protein coagulation and improve clarity; however, a lower pH does also reduce the alpha acid extraction, which is another important factor in your beer’s head retention.

(01:01:46)
Finally, through fermentation and in the finished beer, a lower pH is optimal for head retention. Something to watch out for is dry hopping, which can also result in increased pH in the beer. This, in turn, reduces your head retention. The funny thing is that the exact compound responsible for the increase in pH hasn’t really been identified in dry hopping yet. There are theories that the shift in pH comes from the leaf of the hop and not the glands. So that’s kind of a fun fact for you. I think I’m just going to leave it at that, because I think we could have another episode on head retention. I think that might be in store, ladies?

Cheyenne (01:02:27):
Definitely.

Heather (01:02:28):
We could do a part too, I think. I feel like there’s just so many factors, and we got very broad, I think, with it. I mean, we could dissect every part of it.

Cheyenne (01:02:37):
Definitely.

Abi (01:02:37):
Definitely.

Cheyenne (01:02:38):
For sure.

Heather (01:02:39):
That’s amazing.

Cheyenne (01:02:40):
Abi, to tack onto that question, and maybe this isn’t a thing, but do you know if you can go the other direction, where if you go too low on pH, will it negatively affect head retention? Is it like a balancing act?

Abi (01:02:51):
Yep, it is. You want to find that balance between the two of them with your pH.

Cheyenne (01:02:56):
Got it.

Abi (01:02:56):
Otherwise, your head retention is definitely going to be affected.

Cheyenne (01:02:58):
Yeah, for sure. That’s good to know. Well, awesome. Then, the second question that we have for you, what are your favorite or recommended ways of brewing with RO water? Are there any calculators that you recommend?

Abi (01:03:09):
Yes, RO. That’s the blank canvas that some of us love. I’m sure you all know RO is reverse osmosis, which is the treatment of the removal of all minerals from resident water. Typically, your resident water dictates the style of beers you can ideally make at your brewery, and some prefer it this way, but others prefer to not be limited by their local supply. That being said, brewing with RO water reduces some of those complexities of beers brewed with regular water, making the brew a little less bright and flavorful. Therefore, you’re going to have to, I’m using my finger quotes right now, decorate your brew with a few minerals to bring those complexities back in. The first step in brewing with RO is knowing your end goals.

(01:03:56)
You want to know what kind of style you’re going for, and you want to know, from there, what minerals you want to add back into achieve those goals. The most important mineral that’s missing from RO water, when we brew, is calcium. Calcium interacts with polypeptides and phosphates from malt to effect mash. It also stabilizes amylase. It involves breakdown, formation, and wart, and it can also influence yeast. So it’s really important. There are two different kinds of calcium that you can add to your RO water to improve taste. There’s calcium chloride and calcium sulfate. Calcium chloride tends to soften the mouth feel a little bit more and accentuate the malt character, whereas calcium sulfate contributes a little bit more of a drier finish and enhances hop character.

(01:04:47)
From here. There’s a whole slew of additives that you may need to, or you might want to, utilize when you’re brewing with RO water. I wouldn’t say that I have a personal favorite because, like I said, you have to know your end goal, and that changes with beer styles. Some of the additives that you can use are Epsom salt, which is used for the magnesium and sulfate contribution. Then, you have table salt, which is otherwise known as sodium chloride. This brings sodium and chloride into the water. I also know some folks who use chalk or calcium carbonate to raise the mash pH. I, personally, don’t recommend this, because it kind of creates a cloudy mess, and it doesn’t dissolve very well, in my experience. To raise the mash P mash pH, you can add baking soda.

(01:05:34)
Sometimes that’s not ideal, because it still adds in that sodium into your water. If you don’t want to do this, you can add pickling lime, which is calcium hydroxide. That’s another option for buffering a raising pH. Lactic acid can be used to acidify, strike, and sparge water. There are just so many different routes that you can go depending on your end goal and beer style. As far as calculators, I personally have not had the pleasure of using one, myself, yet, but when I asked some of my favorite brewers what they recommend, they all said Bru’n Water. It’s spelled B-R-U-N water, and this calculator is a spreadsheet, like most of the other calculators. My friend, Aaron, said that he learned a lot more about water chemistry, just tinkering with this calculator than anything else in his career. This might be a really great way to start learning about the different additives that I talked about and how it can affect your brew.

Cheyenne (01:06:30):
That’s awesome, and it seems like a really perfect question to kind of tie in with the first question you got, where you’re talking about something different. You’re talking about head retention, but we’re still kind of going back to pH.

Abi (01:06:40):
Definitely.

Cheyenne (01:06:41):
That’s a super cool question. We might have to do a full episode on water chemistry and pH, I think.

Abi (01:06:46):
Yeah.

Cheyenne (01:06:48):
Awesome. Well, to wrap up, we’ve been asking all of our guests, what advice would you have for your younger self before getting into the craft beverage industry?

Abi (01:06:57):
Let’s see. That’s a good question. Honestly, I would say buy good boots. It’s worth it. I had the crappiest boots for the longest time, and definitely worth it to buy the good ones. Another thing I would say is just remember, you’re not going to learn everything in one day. Time and experience are the best way to learn, and it’s okay to fail along the way. As a woman in the industry, I would say you’re going to be surrounded by men, and it’s not worth it to get mad when they don’t look at you when you speak. Just keep moving, and don’t let it distract you. Trust me, you’re going to end up with a pretty great seat at the table, so that’s what I would tell young me.

Cheyenne (01:07:37):
That is awesome.

Heather (01:07:40):
Awesome.

Cheyenne (01:07:40):
Thank you so much, Abi.

Natasha (01:07:41):
Thanks so much, Abi.

Heather (01:07:43):
If anyone out there has any questions that they would like Abi to cover, please shoot us an email at thebrewdeck@countrymalt.com. Well, that is a wrap for today for the Brew Deck Podcast. Thank you for joining us. Great, big thank you to Karlie from Tofino Brewing and Brittany from MadTree Brewing. Happy International Women’s Day to everyone listening. Make sure, if you’re not participating in a brew, to go out there and look on the shelves for Pink Boots Beer near you.

Natasha (01:08:10):
And if you’re interested in finding out more about Pink Boots Canada, you can follow us on social media at Pink Boots Canada and find out about events and beer releases near you.

Heather (01:08:20):
We’ll be back in a couple of weeks, celebrating Women’s History Month by exploring history of women in the brewing industry.

Cheyenne (01:08:27):
And don’t forget to subscribe to the Brew Deck Podcast wherever you listen to your podcast, so you don’t miss an episode.

Heather (01:08:32):
Bye-bye.

Natasha (01:08:33):
Bye-bye.